Woodstock Primary LZ permission ends on Nov 17

[mingram]

I received a very nice letter from the current owners (Lynn and Rick Zoll) informing the club that they're selling the farm. Landing will no longer be allowed in the primary LZ (Fishburn Farm) effective Nov 17.

Lynn expressed that we have given them a great deal of pleasure in the past and hope the new owners will realize we are "a plus to the area" and hope they will allow future landings. They also thanked us for the holiday gifts.

Matt

[mingram]

I just talked with the real estate agent (Bill Nordman) who sold the property to the new owner Bill Parsons. The agent told me that Mr. Parsons is a lawyer who doesn't want to deal with the liability involved with free flight. He described him as adamant about this. However, he did said we should try to send him a letter to his Woodstock address. He also mentioned that Mr. Parsons is a pilot.

Not very encouraging news. USHPA 3rd party insurance and VA statues cover landowners of any liability and we could boost that coverage with additional insurance and waivers. Perhaps we could explain that and explain that we're working to secure alternative LZs and ask for emergency landing permission as a start. Any other ideas?

[dbodner]

Citrus is the answer! Not really, but absent any CHGPA-board direction to the contrary, I'll add the new owner to our Christmas gift list. Is that 2497 Moose Rd? I'm also removing the old landowner.

I think the following post answers the question of why landowners don't trust waivers and recreational use statutes. They'll win, but it'll cost them serious money. http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.ph ... c&start=40 See post #44 from USPHA insurance guru Mark Forbes.

Spitballing here: Is it possible for the club to post a bond to cover anticipated legal fees in the event of a stupid lawsuit?

[Joe Schad]

I stopped by the Woodstock LZ and met the new owner and his wife. Very nice folks. Bill explained to me that the reason is will not let hang gliders land is because the State Farm insurance agent (Doug Veich?) said State Farm would not insure his property if he permitted hang gliders to land on the property even if they had third party liability insurance. Bill is willing to talk with us about why he has said no hang glider landings and might well be open to letting us do so if we can find a way around the problem of liability insurance and the insurance on his property. I don't whether it is State Farm the company that has taken the position that they will not insure a property if hang gliders land on the property or if this is something the local agent will not do. Maybe USHGPA would know it this is the norm with all insurance companies now. It may well be. At any rate hope this information helps who ever is working to find a solution to getting permission to land in the old primary LZ.

Also, Mr Parson said he plans to build a house on the north end of what is the primary landing area. Bill's email address is: parsonsfamily@starpower.net. He said email is the best way to contact him. I gave them a Xmas card and a loaf of bread from Zelda and me. Zelda and I head west on Dec 23 and will return in June or July.

Joe

[mingram]

Cross post with permission from Jim McClave:

"Interesting post on a hang glider site that details a number of legal cases tied to paragliding and hang gliding accidents. The analysis is biased blaming paragliding for the insurance problems but the cases are interesting.

http://www.ushawks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=2092

They show that lawsuits are brought against landowners even when waivers and laws exist to try to protect the landowners from lawsuits. The landowners then have to expend $s on legal expenses even though they have at best a tangential tie to the activity that caused the incident. My guess is this is why State Farm will not provide insurance to the new Woodstock primary landowner if he allows landings on his property."

[Danny Brotto]

From my memory, Washington County and the CHGA/MHGA was sued by a girl (non pilot) who injured herself when she fell off of the platform at HR. No one was flying at the time so there was no connection with HGing other than falling off a structure where hang gliding occurs. The USHGA insurance hired the lawyers and successfully defended the case. This was perhaps 10 to 15 years ago?

At one point the liability insurance was $1M. Somewhere along the line it became bumped up to $2M. Why do we need $2M in coverage? Perhaps its to protect landowners from a potential huge settlement loss?

It would be interesting to see an accounting of insurance payouts from the last number of years.

Danny Brotto

[mingram]

Are there any insurance agents or lawyers in the club? Jim McClave suggested we, "pull together a working group for maintaining access to launch and landings and it would be very useful to have folks with this expertise on the working group."