Most of you have probably heard the news by now. Bill Priday is gone. The first launch of the first day of the meet, and someone dies. Not a good start (as if we cared about the meet now). We're all still suffering from that hollow emptiness that lingers after something so horrible.
I saw Bill launch. I watched him pick up his glider, answered his radio check, and watched him move up to launch. I saw him pick up his glider, yell clear, run, and drop from sight below the edge. I ran up to launch, along with several other people, just in time to see Bill's glider do a graceful hammerhead---fly straight up, almost back to launch. At that point I thought Bill was in the glider. Then glider fell off to the side, and I saw an empty control frame...a sight I'll never forget...and a sick feeling of dread filled my stomach.
I'm still asking, asking, asking, over and over, asking myself and others...how could we all be looking right at Bill---watching his every move, and not even notice there were no harness mains attached to his keel? How can our eyes be so useless? There were 5-6 people (maybe more) at launch with Bill. He had a wire crew. I'm blaming nobody and everybody, myself included.
There were too many new things here. Too many new things, and they caught up to Bill. A new site, flying with GPS and radio for one of the first times (Bill was futzing with these just before he launched), a competition setting, 30-40 gliders packed into a small launch area, pressure to get to launch and get off...too many new things. I felt pressure to launch, for the first time since I started flying. I didn't like it one bit, and it wasn't easy to ignore it and take my time. It felt dangerous. The sky was opening up after a cloudy, crappy morning. It got sunny, started blowing in. Excitement levels went up.
When we arrived at launch, there were only two spaces left near launch to set up...a small hole in the middle, which I took, and a clear space right next to launch, which Bill took. He was enthusiastic, gung-ho, possibly overly so. But that was Bill. The guy lived for flying. He loved it more than anything, and it was so obvious to those of us around him. The end result? An ocean of gliders, with Bill at the very front. He wanted out of there, and to be in the air. He just forgot to hook in. I don't even think he did a hang check. I don't know how or why. Nobody else noticed he wasn't hooked in. Nobody else checking. We all just let him go right off the cliff. It was a big drop---higher than High Rock. He should never have been first off launch at a site he'd never flown. He didn't see anyone launch first. He just went.
A group of local pilots pulled his glider from the trees, with very little damage. (Gliders don't land hard when they're empty.) It took the EMTs a while to get him out of the woods. He didn't stand a chance---he died instantly (I say this based on the severity of his injuries, which were extreme.) The meet was cancelled today. We all broke down. There was no way I was going to fly after that, no way. I don't even know about the rest of the week, and neither do the others in our group.
We retrieved Bill's glider and harness, and put them back into his truck. We still have to break down his campsite, where I sat and talked with him this morning while he heated water for coffee on his stove. His guitar is still over there, leaning against a tree. Linda is going to drive Bill's truck back to Richmond, bless her.
I love this sport. And two major accidents to people I cared about just a few months apart is a lot. Almost too much to bear. Makes me think hard.
I took on the task of notifying Bill's relatives. I talked to his ex-wife. I talked to his younger sister, then his older sister. Not fun conversations. I called the local hospital to confirm he was there and get information to pass on to his family, so they can call to make the necessary arrangements.
This really sucks. It really, really sucks. I miss Bill terribly. He had faults, but we all do. This sport is so unforgiving. So black or white. Now things seem surreal. There is a campfire, people around it talking. In the pavilion, others are watching a DVD on flying cross-country in the Sequatchie Valley, applause when the DVD is over. I know, life goes on. But it's hard just to be casual and sociable.
There will be a pilots' meeting tomorrow morning. We'll talk about the accident. Tomorrow won't be a meet day---no tasks. Just free flying, whatever people want to do. That's how it should be.
I have no idea if I will fly again. I want to very much...but this is like a hole inside, through which I still feel the pain and dread. I could never, ever let this happen to me. (I have a young daughter.) Do we really have to fly to enjoy life? Aren't there other things that make life worth living? I just need time. So do some of the others.
Our group had dinner tonight in Dunlap. We raised our beers to Bill, his life, and his love for flying. It wasn't a happy toast.
I'm sorry if this message sounds incoherent. I'm just trying to capture what went on, and it's hard to avoid how I'm feeling. Others may have their stories to post too...
With a heavy heart,
Scott
Bill Priday's death
Moderator: CHGPA BOD
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Flying Lobster
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Thanks for the terrible job of reporting this to us and Holly, Scott.
I talked to Linda about the event the day before she left, and there are some aspects to this that I don't understand. No attempt at playing the blame game here--just trying to get an idea what may have contributed to this tragedy (other than pilot pre-flight hook-in technique).
Although its been a good long while since I've been there, I always thought Whitwell was a hang 4 or advanced 3 launch. Linda told me they already forecasted flying from there for much of the week, and I told her to not underestimate the seriousness of launching there. There was the notion that extra effort was going to be devoted to lower experienced pilots. Also, I've never been to a comp there that didn't have a launch safety director, and I am curious if there was one.
marc
survivor of launching unhooked and immediate adopter of Aussie technique
I talked to Linda about the event the day before she left, and there are some aspects to this that I don't understand. No attempt at playing the blame game here--just trying to get an idea what may have contributed to this tragedy (other than pilot pre-flight hook-in technique).
Although its been a good long while since I've been there, I always thought Whitwell was a hang 4 or advanced 3 launch. Linda told me they already forecasted flying from there for much of the week, and I told her to not underestimate the seriousness of launching there. There was the notion that extra effort was going to be devoted to lower experienced pilots. Also, I've never been to a comp there that didn't have a launch safety director, and I am curious if there was one.
marc
survivor of launching unhooked and immediate adopter of Aussie technique
Great Googly-moo!
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Paul Tjaden
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Bill Priday's death
In a message dated 10/2/2005 9:08:22 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, in_a_cloud@hotmail.com writes:
I don't think Marc means " you did a terrible job of reporting" (although that's what I thought when I first read it) just that it was a terrible job to do. Right Marc? Or maybe I'm the only one stupid enough to read it that way.
?
Paul
Thanks for the terrible job of reporting this to us and Holly, Scott.
I don't think Marc means " you did a terrible job of reporting" (although that's what I thought when I first read it) just that it was a terrible job to do. Right Marc? Or maybe I'm the only one stupid enough to read it that way.
?
Paul
This one hits me hard. I met Bill at Hyner 4th of July - his first mountain experience, and we were instantly friends. I think everyone was instantly friends with Bill: he had a magical way with people, with his guitar, with his approach to life. Mountain flying was new to him, and he was captivated by it. At the Pulpit party he enthused about the new world that was opening up to him; all the new people he met and the new insights he was gaining. We were looking forward to many happy years flying together. My only consolation is that in his last few months so many new people had a chance to be touched by him.
I'm afraid that as a new moutain pilot he hadn't time to absorb the urgency of the hang-check - it's largely automatic when towing. We once had a requirement at High Rock that even if someone had done a hang check below they should do another on launch...the consequences of missing it is too severe. We shouldn't need this reminder to reinstate basic safety procedures.
I was privilaged as one of his friends to be notified by phone yesterday. It took hours to recover, and is still sinking in. He'd want us to fly in his memory, and if I feel my emotional state is right later today I intend to. But it's hard, painful hard.
I'm afraid that as a new moutain pilot he hadn't time to absorb the urgency of the hang-check - it's largely automatic when towing. We once had a requirement at High Rock that even if someone had done a hang check below they should do another on launch...the consequences of missing it is too severe. We shouldn't need this reminder to reinstate basic safety procedures.
I was privilaged as one of his friends to be notified by phone yesterday. It took hours to recover, and is still sinking in. He'd want us to fly in his memory, and if I feel my emotional state is right later today I intend to. But it's hard, painful hard.
Brian Vant-Hull
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Flying Lobster
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Re: Bill Priday's death
You're right--I meant terrible as in "painful, sad, I'd rather-not-have -to" not that he did a bad job of reporting. Have to watch the connotations.Paul Tjaden wrote:In a message dated 10/2/2005 9:08:22 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, in_a_cloud@hotmail.com writes:Thanks for the terrible job of reporting this to us and Holly, Scott.
I don't think Marc means " you did a terrible job of reporting" (although that's what I thought when I first read it) just that it was a terrible job to do. Right Marc? Or maybe I'm the only one stupid enough to read it that way.
?
Paul
marc
Great Googly-moo!
Whitwell is a cliff launch, period. It's like High Rock, or Zirk's, or Lookout, or any other cliff launch. Not a flat rock or concrete block, but a grass launch that rolls off a radiused lip, then drops vertically at least 75 feet, possibly more. Wide open, no nearby trees or branches behind launch. It didn't strike me as being any more (or less) difficult than High Rock. It's true that Bill had little to no cliff launch experience (just a few launches at Lookout last year, and Hyner---if that counts as a cliff launch?)Although its been a good long while since I've been there, I always thought Whitwell was a hang 4 or advanced 3 launch. Linda told me they already forecasted flying from there for much of the week, and I told her to not underestimate the seriousness of launching there.
It's a H3 launch because the primary LZ is a bit far, but only slightly farther than the Pulpit primary---it's not so far out as just farther down the ridge (like the Pulpit). So if there is lift on the ridge, no sweat. If it's dead (or if one hits sink) you better head straight to the LZ.)
Scott
I met Bill at the Pulpit fly in. The most time I spent with Bill was while playing guitar around the fire on Saturday night. It was a deep musical conversation ... I will always remember it. On Sunday, we spoke verbally of it ... and concluded that we were certainly going to jam together again. I was really looking forward to that.
I only knew Bill for a short time. At the time, I didn't fully grasp how precious is this brief time that we share together. This fact is sinking in now ... deeply ... each time I think of Bill ... and others in this family of ours who have left this life.
I am thankful for the brief time I spent with Bill ... a priceless gift.
I will never forget.
'Spark
I only knew Bill for a short time. At the time, I didn't fully grasp how precious is this brief time that we share together. This fact is sinking in now ... deeply ... each time I think of Bill ... and others in this family of ours who have left this life.
I am thankful for the brief time I spent with Bill ... a priceless gift.
I will never forget.
'Spark
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Flying Lobster
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Sorry Scott, but it really isn't like those other launches.Scott wrote:Whitwell is a cliff launch, period. It's like High Rock, or Zirk's, or Lookout, or any other cliff launch. Not a flat rock or concrete block, but a grass launch that rolls off a radiused lip, then drops vertically at least 75 feet, possibly more. Wide open, no nearby trees or branches behind launch. It didn't strike me as being any more (or less) difficult than High Rock. It's true that Bill had little to no cliff launch experience (just a few launches at Lookout last year, and Hyner---if that counts as a cliff launch?)Although its been a good long while since I've been there, I always thought Whitwell was a hang 4 or advanced 3 launch. Linda told me they already forecasted flying from there for much of the week, and I told her to not underestimate the seriousness of launching there.
It's a H3 launch because the primary LZ is a bit far, but only slightly farther than the Pulpit primary---it's not so far out as just farther down the ridge (like the Pulpit). So if there is lift on the ridge, no sweat. If it's dead (or if one hits sink) you better head straight to the LZ.)
Scott
marc
Great Googly-moo!
Definition of a Hang Check & Bill P
I just read the following item from the OzForum by a secondary on-site (not witness) report:
" According to at least 5 local pilots, Bill had set up his glider and was moving it closer to launch. Again, according to at least 5 pilots, Bill was asked if he wanted a hang check, but was heard to say "It has been taken care of". "
This is eerie, because Hank H. and I were involved with an almost identical conversation with Bill at the Pulpit Fly-In. As we were walking Bill up to the old ramp, with me on right wing and Hank on nose, Hank asked bill if he wanted a hang check. Bill's reply was something like, "No thanks, I'm good." Hank then pointed out that he was not hooked in. I remarked that 'you are not hooked in until after the hang check.' We ran Bill through a routine lay-down hang check at the back of the ramp, and he had a fine launch.
With at least two situations of the same conversation, I am beginning to wonder if maybe Bill's personal definition of a 'hang check' is the fitting & adjustment check to ensure that your hang strap has you hanging at the correct height over the bar. All of us with full foot launch training and primary mountain flight assume that the hang check is the check for connection, and not just the check for position. If Bill was confident that his straps were all set properly, then Hank's question, and that of the '5 people' at Tennesse translated to, "Is your harness adjusted to hang at the right height?" and not teh intended "have you confirmed you are connected to the glider?'
Bill trained as a tow pilot, and added mountain flying to his repertoire only this summer. In all tow methods that use a platform or cart, the hang check / hook check is conducted automatically by laying down in the harness prior to engaging the tow mechanism. Only when foot launching on tow (like scooter tows and some pilots' satic line vehicle tow method), can you begin full launch commitment without being hooked in.
I cannot speak for the use of the term 'hang check' in Bill's training and experience at the tow park. I know from personal experience that there is no more safety conscious instructor around than Steve W.
But with Bill's repeated assertion of a completed hang check with no hook-in, I can only guess that he had somehow redifined 'hang check' in his own mind to something other than what we all use at the mountains.
Maybe, at every site, when a pilot tells us he has already done a hang check, we should insist on asking WHO was the checker/observer of the check. Except for the true lone pilot / last pilot self-launch situation (which I have done at WS and Bill's, and will do again), our community defintion of a hang check should be "positive confirmation of proper connection of the harness to the glider, OBSERVED AND CHECKED BY A SECOND PARTY OTHER THAN THE PILOT."
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That's the dry analysis part.
On the personal level, I want to add my voice to the expressions of friendship, admiration, loss, and grief for this tragedy. As a Blue Sky regular I have been getting to know Bill over the past year. There has been no more personable, friendly, and helpful pilot than Bill in our community. I miss him. I mourn the loss to his family, his external community, and our flying community.
I, like so many others, so hate that once more a pilot was lost because of his own tragic error, possibly compounded by a breakdown of what should be a community support process.
I've said my prayers for Bill. I hope they help him. I know they help me.
cragin
" According to at least 5 local pilots, Bill had set up his glider and was moving it closer to launch. Again, according to at least 5 pilots, Bill was asked if he wanted a hang check, but was heard to say "It has been taken care of". "
This is eerie, because Hank H. and I were involved with an almost identical conversation with Bill at the Pulpit Fly-In. As we were walking Bill up to the old ramp, with me on right wing and Hank on nose, Hank asked bill if he wanted a hang check. Bill's reply was something like, "No thanks, I'm good." Hank then pointed out that he was not hooked in. I remarked that 'you are not hooked in until after the hang check.' We ran Bill through a routine lay-down hang check at the back of the ramp, and he had a fine launch.
With at least two situations of the same conversation, I am beginning to wonder if maybe Bill's personal definition of a 'hang check' is the fitting & adjustment check to ensure that your hang strap has you hanging at the correct height over the bar. All of us with full foot launch training and primary mountain flight assume that the hang check is the check for connection, and not just the check for position. If Bill was confident that his straps were all set properly, then Hank's question, and that of the '5 people' at Tennesse translated to, "Is your harness adjusted to hang at the right height?" and not teh intended "have you confirmed you are connected to the glider?'
Bill trained as a tow pilot, and added mountain flying to his repertoire only this summer. In all tow methods that use a platform or cart, the hang check / hook check is conducted automatically by laying down in the harness prior to engaging the tow mechanism. Only when foot launching on tow (like scooter tows and some pilots' satic line vehicle tow method), can you begin full launch commitment without being hooked in.
I cannot speak for the use of the term 'hang check' in Bill's training and experience at the tow park. I know from personal experience that there is no more safety conscious instructor around than Steve W.
But with Bill's repeated assertion of a completed hang check with no hook-in, I can only guess that he had somehow redifined 'hang check' in his own mind to something other than what we all use at the mountains.
Maybe, at every site, when a pilot tells us he has already done a hang check, we should insist on asking WHO was the checker/observer of the check. Except for the true lone pilot / last pilot self-launch situation (which I have done at WS and Bill's, and will do again), our community defintion of a hang check should be "positive confirmation of proper connection of the harness to the glider, OBSERVED AND CHECKED BY A SECOND PARTY OTHER THAN THE PILOT."
-------
That's the dry analysis part.
On the personal level, I want to add my voice to the expressions of friendship, admiration, loss, and grief for this tragedy. As a Blue Sky regular I have been getting to know Bill over the past year. There has been no more personable, friendly, and helpful pilot than Bill in our community. I miss him. I mourn the loss to his family, his external community, and our flying community.
I, like so many others, so hate that once more a pilot was lost because of his own tragic error, possibly compounded by a breakdown of what should be a community support process.
I've said my prayers for Bill. I hope they help him. I know they help me.
cragin
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Flying Lobster
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hepcat1989
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Wow, I didn't know about his Hang check procedure........The last I had talked to him was at the fly-in. He used to fly the same wing as I, Pulse2 11m.He seemed to me to be a super nice guy, with a good sense of humor as he described the color of that wing.We shared a brew before I had rode my cycle home. I'm sorry that it happened....... Shawn
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bustedwing2
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reply
Sorry to hear about the loss,I too had the privilege of sitting around the fire and listening to Bill play with Sparky.Sometimes I feel like a goofball when I ask somebody if they want a hang check when approaching the ramp and they've done it already,perhaps it should become mandatory just prior to launch? Rich B.
what is your problem
Marc
You know I follow this list and support the club because I'm from the area and have flown here at all the sites for years before my wife and I moved out of the area. I am not a 'forum' person but I do follow the the list to keep up with what is going on.....I normally don't respond to what I feel is out of the ball park or other ---wise.... ......but Marc.....I don't know you.....but you really need to get a grip.....really...
The Whit launch is rated 4 only because of the glide to the LZ. The launch skill for the site is not much different than Zirks.....
And to make statements that the launch crew just left Bill run off ....knowing he wasn't hooked in .....is just plain hurtful
The pain about the loss of Bill is bad enough.....but making statements like you have made about the launch crew is inappropriate at the least...
How would 'you' feel if you had just happened to be one of the launch crew and this happened on your watch....
Why make more pain.....what we need is to heal...find peace in this tragedy....and help each other..... All of us are just human ....
With respect
Bud A
You know I follow this list and support the club because I'm from the area and have flown here at all the sites for years before my wife and I moved out of the area. I am not a 'forum' person but I do follow the the list to keep up with what is going on.....I normally don't respond to what I feel is out of the ball park or other ---wise.... ......but Marc.....I don't know you.....but you really need to get a grip.....really...
The Whit launch is rated 4 only because of the glide to the LZ. The launch skill for the site is not much different than Zirks.....
And to make statements that the launch crew just left Bill run off ....knowing he wasn't hooked in .....is just plain hurtful
The pain about the loss of Bill is bad enough.....but making statements like you have made about the launch crew is inappropriate at the least...
How would 'you' feel if you had just happened to be one of the launch crew and this happened on your watch....
Why make more pain.....what we need is to heal...find peace in this tragedy....and help each other..... All of us are just human ....
With respect
Bud A
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batmanh3
I'm usually not one to stand up for Marc, but I'll go out on a limb on this one. I think its his wording that came across wrong rather than his intent. Marc was questioning a previous post of a launch crew questioning Bill on whether he was hooked in. I was the safety director at the Pulpit Fly-In and was one of the people questioning Bill about his hang check. When Bill assured us that he had accomplished his hang check, I just asked him why he wasn't hooked in then? We forced him to back off of launch and complete a full hang check in front of us. It is daft to think anyone would of let him launch in that condition and I do not believe Marc was alluding to that thought. I know emotions are very raw and we are all hurt at this loss. We are all in shock and just trying to figure out the why's to be able to deal with this and move forward.
Chris
Chris
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Flying Lobster
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Sorry you read more into what I said than I intended--but I've come to expect that from a faceless form of communication such as this. I think I actually said at the very beginning that I'm not interested in playing the blame game--because it would be foolish for me or anyone else to do so.
But I assume that there is some common interest in getting some information that might help others improve their flying or safety. However you take it--even negatively--is your bag, not mine, pal.
But just to make things clear--Whitwell is NOTHING like Zirks, and the other launches its compared to, it doesn't even face the same direction. It's possible that it has changed since the last time I was there, but I remember a rather smallish launch mound, followed by a short shelf, which is then followed by a sharp dropoff. None of the other launches feature the duplicate layout and hence I don't feel its an accurate statement that launching there is the same as the other launches its compared to. But so what--this has little relevance to the accident.
As for my hang check comment, all I'm asking is don't you think its a little strange that 5 or more pilots at or near launch would say "you want a hang check?" rather than "Hey buddy--do you know you're unhooked?" if in fact they looked the pilot over?? Please tell me what you think is so over the top about that.
marc
But I assume that there is some common interest in getting some information that might help others improve their flying or safety. However you take it--even negatively--is your bag, not mine, pal.
But just to make things clear--Whitwell is NOTHING like Zirks, and the other launches its compared to, it doesn't even face the same direction. It's possible that it has changed since the last time I was there, but I remember a rather smallish launch mound, followed by a short shelf, which is then followed by a sharp dropoff. None of the other launches feature the duplicate layout and hence I don't feel its an accurate statement that launching there is the same as the other launches its compared to. But so what--this has little relevance to the accident.
As for my hang check comment, all I'm asking is don't you think its a little strange that 5 or more pilots at or near launch would say "you want a hang check?" rather than "Hey buddy--do you know you're unhooked?" if in fact they looked the pilot over?? Please tell me what you think is so over the top about that.
marc
Great Googly-moo!
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Flying Lobster
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Re: what is your problem
Please show me or quote anything i said about the launch crew--be very careful about what you accuse others of saying unless you're sure they accually said it.BudA wrote:Marc
You know I follow this list and support the club because I'm from the area and have flown here at all the sites for years before my wife and I moved out of the area. I am not a 'forum' person but I do follow the the list to keep up with what is going on.....I normally don't respond to what I feel is out of the ball park or other ---wise.... ......but Marc.....I don't know you.....but you really need to get a grip.....really...
The Whit launch is rated 4 only because of the glide to the LZ. The launch skill for the site is not much different than Zirks.....
And to make statements that the launch crew just left Bill run off ....knowing he wasn't hooked in .....is just plain hurtful
The pain about the loss of Bill is bad enough.....but making statements like you have made about the launch crew is inappropriate at the least...
How would 'you' feel if you had just happened to be one of the launch crew and this happened on your watch....
Why make more pain.....what we need is to heal...find peace in this tragedy....and help each other..... All of us are just human ....
With respect
Bud A
marc
Great Googly-moo!
faceless
Marc
You are right about my sharing in the desire to keep this from happening to anyone of us 'ever' again. And, .....dealing with the hurt is part of the process. I wish I could have been there...part of the wire crew...maybe I could have spotted that his hang strap was limp.... But, in not being there I can only feel the horrible pain that the real wire crew has to feel now; or how the TTT people feel, or even any of the local folks from the club that traveled with Bill feel. Bill could be realy gung ho about flying....he became a quick friend to both my wife and I; he was the kind of person you don't quickly forget..... he was a pal.....in the real sense. I'ts easy to imply that TTT shouldn't have been letting him fly the site, or what the wire crew did wasn't up to par. But when I start thinking in those terms I know it can only help to further hurt those that 'were' there.
There is a lot of pain in our house right now.... And though my communication with you 'is' faceless... I 'am' a fellow pilot sharing the same concerns as you......and without this incident....I'm sure I would be your 'pal'. I am sorry if I did misunderstand your statements. I speak with many pilots from all over the country...many may always remain faceless.....but I would not say I would come to expect this ....or ...that...from them.
I would love to fly with you some day...so that I am not faceless...
Marc....I have come to see that all pilots have a strangely similar face.....big smiles, wide eyes. and wind burned faces.... It's just that.....right now, this pilot's face, and his wife's, is very sad. I can't imagine being one of the TTT crew, or one of the local folks that went with Bill to the valley.....
With respect and peace
Bud A
You are right about my sharing in the desire to keep this from happening to anyone of us 'ever' again. And, .....dealing with the hurt is part of the process. I wish I could have been there...part of the wire crew...maybe I could have spotted that his hang strap was limp.... But, in not being there I can only feel the horrible pain that the real wire crew has to feel now; or how the TTT people feel, or even any of the local folks from the club that traveled with Bill feel. Bill could be realy gung ho about flying....he became a quick friend to both my wife and I; he was the kind of person you don't quickly forget..... he was a pal.....in the real sense. I'ts easy to imply that TTT shouldn't have been letting him fly the site, or what the wire crew did wasn't up to par. But when I start thinking in those terms I know it can only help to further hurt those that 'were' there.
There is a lot of pain in our house right now.... And though my communication with you 'is' faceless... I 'am' a fellow pilot sharing the same concerns as you......and without this incident....I'm sure I would be your 'pal'. I am sorry if I did misunderstand your statements. I speak with many pilots from all over the country...many may always remain faceless.....but I would not say I would come to expect this ....or ...that...from them.
I would love to fly with you some day...so that I am not faceless...
Marc....I have come to see that all pilots have a strangely similar face.....big smiles, wide eyes. and wind burned faces.... It's just that.....right now, this pilot's face, and his wife's, is very sad. I can't imagine being one of the TTT crew, or one of the local folks that went with Bill to the valley.....
With respect and peace
Bud A
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theflyingdude
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[quote=But just to make things clear--Whitwell is NOTHING like Zirks, and the other launches its compared to, it doesn't even face the same direction. It's possible that it has changed since the last time I was there, but I remember a rather smallish launch mound, followed by a short shelf, which is then followed by a sharp drop off. None of the other launches feature the duplicate layout and hence I don't feel its an accurate statement that launching there is the same as the other launches its compared to. But so what--this has little relevance to the accident.[/quote]
Marc is correct. The Whitwell launch is nothing like Zirks. Zirks is a steep grassy slope that ultimately terminates into a vertical rock face several hundred feet below launch. Whitwell (H3-rated launch) is basically a cliff-launch from a small shelf. It's pretty much vertical right off of launch.
Launching unhooked has been killing HG pilots since before I started flying in 1979. There have been many suggested solutions to the problem including checklists and even some mechanical contraptions. No system is bullet-proof. It's the pilot's life that's at risk and ultimately it will always be his/her responsibility to confirm that they're hooked in and ready to launch. A wire crew and/or other pilots at launch can and should keep their eyes open to aid in the process, but should never be relied upon (or blamed if something goes awry).
Most of the Cumberland sites are self-launchable, even in a significant amount of wind, and we often don't have a wire-crew available. My personal process is to hook into the glider in the set-up area and then lean through the control frame while the glider is resting on the keel. I do this to confirm that I'm hooked in (if I fall on my face, I'm not) and to make sure my hang strap is straight. I then carry out to launch and just prior to starting my run, I raise the glider high enough so I can feel pressure/tension on my harness straps. If I unhook for any reason while on launch, I'll repeat the process of leaning thru the control frame and then raise the glider until I feel pressure on the straps. It may not be fool-proof, but thus far it's worked for me.
I'm sorry I never got to meet Bill and we never got to share air or play guitar together. It sounds like he was a great guy and one who will be greatly missed. Flying is a dangerous endeavor. Please be careful out there.
JR
Marc is correct. The Whitwell launch is nothing like Zirks. Zirks is a steep grassy slope that ultimately terminates into a vertical rock face several hundred feet below launch. Whitwell (H3-rated launch) is basically a cliff-launch from a small shelf. It's pretty much vertical right off of launch.
Launching unhooked has been killing HG pilots since before I started flying in 1979. There have been many suggested solutions to the problem including checklists and even some mechanical contraptions. No system is bullet-proof. It's the pilot's life that's at risk and ultimately it will always be his/her responsibility to confirm that they're hooked in and ready to launch. A wire crew and/or other pilots at launch can and should keep their eyes open to aid in the process, but should never be relied upon (or blamed if something goes awry).
Most of the Cumberland sites are self-launchable, even in a significant amount of wind, and we often don't have a wire-crew available. My personal process is to hook into the glider in the set-up area and then lean through the control frame while the glider is resting on the keel. I do this to confirm that I'm hooked in (if I fall on my face, I'm not) and to make sure my hang strap is straight. I then carry out to launch and just prior to starting my run, I raise the glider high enough so I can feel pressure/tension on my harness straps. If I unhook for any reason while on launch, I'll repeat the process of leaning thru the control frame and then raise the glider until I feel pressure on the straps. It may not be fool-proof, but thus far it's worked for me.
I'm sorry I never got to meet Bill and we never got to share air or play guitar together. It sounds like he was a great guy and one who will be greatly missed. Flying is a dangerous endeavor. Please be careful out there.
JR
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Flying Lobster
- Posts: 1042
- Joined: Fri Feb 25, 2005 4:17 pm
No sweat--I know many people are hurting in their own way, I only met Bill a couple of times and I remember him as being a kind-hearted fellow who was jazzed about flying and being around other pilots. I fully understand reacting angrily--been there, done that.
Unfortunately, this kind of thing happens every now and then in hang gliding. Next year I will celebrate committing foot-launch aviation for twenty years, and if you've been at it that long you know alot of friends and associates who have been hurt or killed flying. Or, like me, you have perhaps had some bad accidents and narrowly escaped even killing yourself.
These things are hard to take and emotions naturally run high. There is no use in trying to blame any one thing or event for a tragedy like this--especially in light of nobody knowing what the facts or circumstances around the accident might have been until a timely and detailed investigation can take place.
On the other hand, I think it is not a bad thing to ask as many questions as possible. Indeed, almost a duty to those who have been lost, I would think. That way we won't just chalk it up to "pilot error" as is always the case--but perhaps learn some useful insights that each of us can hopefully use to improve our own level of safety.
marc
Unfortunately, this kind of thing happens every now and then in hang gliding. Next year I will celebrate committing foot-launch aviation for twenty years, and if you've been at it that long you know alot of friends and associates who have been hurt or killed flying. Or, like me, you have perhaps had some bad accidents and narrowly escaped even killing yourself.
These things are hard to take and emotions naturally run high. There is no use in trying to blame any one thing or event for a tragedy like this--especially in light of nobody knowing what the facts or circumstances around the accident might have been until a timely and detailed investigation can take place.
On the other hand, I think it is not a bad thing to ask as many questions as possible. Indeed, almost a duty to those who have been lost, I would think. That way we won't just chalk it up to "pilot error" as is always the case--but perhaps learn some useful insights that each of us can hopefully use to improve our own level of safety.
marc
Great Googly-moo!
launches
It is my opion that all vertical launches that allow (through a small mound, or ramp) the taking of three or four running steips..., should be seen as 'ramp launches', not cliff launches. To me, a cliff launch is standing on the edge of a ramp or cliff, that has a large vertical drop,etc. and with no steps taken, become airborne. To my thinking there are two distinct types of cliff launches: windy, and still air (the first requiring a wire crew; the second ...none needed). Both, however, require special skills to accomplish safely. I am surprised that the USHGA has not delineated on this issue. To me HR, Zirks, Lookout, or any site that gave the pilot immediate elavation, was a site that provided a margin of safety for pilot error on launch. Bills Hill, and many other slope/slot launches always seemed more capable of lulling pilots into a false sense of confidence. It is to this pattern of thought that I believe Whit to be actually safer than say Bill's Hill or other similar launch sites.
With respect
Bud A
With respect
Bud A