Improving The Woodstock Launch

[RichH]

Thanks David that is who I'm meeting with on Jan 5th..I will give everybody an update after the meeting...Thanks

[Matthew]

Awesome! Thanks Rich.

As everyone else has chimed in-- I think we should cover the entire area in crusher run, tamp it down, and then cover that with gray astro-turf. I know Cavanaugh will be against this. But I don't think we will ever get any grass to grow there. And the astro-turf is commonly used for launches in Europe. A gray carpet won't interfere with the natural coloring of the existing landscape.

Matthew

[tomceunen]

Hey I'm just a messenger here, please do not karma me here, thx

http://www.360cities.net/image/12th-fai ... ,0.80,70.0


also from Flypiedrahita.com

Take off improvements
From the previous blog entry you will see that the take off has some light grey patches. This is various tons of a granite dust which is being laid down and compressed with rollers. On top of this the Astro turf will be laid, though not before some concrete drainage channels are dug. The area being prepared is 3000m2. The rollos of Astro turf are 12m wide and are glued together and will be buried at the front and back. Hopefully all will be ready for the 10th of June in time for the Spanish nationals.


In the photo below taken this morning you can clearly see the advance in the work on Take Off. the concrete drainage channels are now in place so I imagine this week we may see the grass go on.


It first needs all to be placed, then glued together, and then to have a number of tons of sand spread on top.

[dbodner]

Wow, that's a beautiful launch, Tom. If we had the money, and the prestige to sell this to the USFS, I'd support it. Simply doing the Pulpit-PG launch thing at Woodstock (like Matthew suggests) is probably far beyond our fiscal or political powers.

I think we can do a lot by simply blasting away a few protruding rocks and filling in some depressions. And maybe some more trimming of vegetation. Or this my HG orientation showing?

[lbunner]

Tom has shown us the Cadillac of launches. I suppose how far we take this will be dependent on Rich's meeting with the powers that be. Surprisingly the turf doesn't look as obtrusive as I thought.

[deveil]

If Gary(S) were to bring in one five ton load of not stone dust but rock (equivalent in volume to five 3/4ton pickup truck loads) and were to drive it in with a rented bobcat (thats a lot of trips) and it were placed right down the middle of the run path - would that hinder any other larger project that might come later?
i.e. do something that can be accomplished the easiest and most quickly and can let a process for something more substantial proceed at its inevitably much slower pace.
basically it would be something between what Rich and Dave Procter were thinking of but with rock.

[mercury]

I was thinking it might be possible to smooth the launch area out with more natural local material such as a few trees laid horizontally at the rocky areas and then back filling with multch would be the cheapest way I can think of for improving the run area a little Matt Young

[dbodner]

Gary, you might be right. Though I thought stone dust would help lock the loose rock together and keep it from washing out. My idea was simply to fill in a few pot holes with the mixture rather than try to do the whole run. From a materials movement perspective, I wonder if it would be easier to bring stuff in from the bottom. The last turn in the road before the parking area is very close to the bottom of the slot. What I remember from my last flight is that it looked closer than it does from the Google satellite shot. Maybe I'll scout around there next time I'm out.

[deveil]

the converse would be the case - the larger stuff would hold the fines in place until the rains come. varied sizes of sharp edged, non round shapes will lock in place certainly better than one uniform size, but fines…

i'd asked Jaryl how in the hell did they put that Pulpit launch together and not have that gravel wash on down the hill. he said it was all about drainage. gravel on top of bigger rocks on top of bigger rocks i.e smaller spaces on top of bigger spaces on top of bigger spaces. the rains just go right on down through and never travel along the surface. if it were just gravel on gravel on dirt it would have been gone long ago.
covering over with fines or filling in with fines accomplishes the opposite.

i'm almost certain that a bobcat wouldn't make it up that slot, particularly carrying a load.

but GaryS sounds like he knows his stuff and i personally would give ground to what he would have to say.

[Roger]

Glad to help when it's decided.

[hang_pilot]

One suggestion for breaking up the big rocks that have caught wing tips and basetubes is to rent a Dingo and a rock breaker from a local construction supply company.

A Dingo is a self-propelled hydraulic power plant that can accept a wide range of attachments. Here’s a video demonstration http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ElXA5-5NmHg.

My concerns about using a jackhammer are safety related: I think we’d need a 60 or a 90 pounder based on the large size of the rocks in question and I would worry about an operator's ability to safely control a large jack on such irregular surfaces.

This assumes that we are agreed that we cannot realistically roll the rocks down the slot with a group effort and a bunch of digging rods.

Best,
Daniel

[RichH]

That is an excellent suggestion..I really like that its safe and so portable..It would be perfect for our needs..Rich

[lbunner]

Ooh! Ooh! I here there is good news coming. I'll let Rich tell you all about it!

[RichH]

Just got back from my meeting with Cameron Seals the Recreational Staff Officer and Katie Donhue at the Lee Ranger District Office. We discussed our needs to improve the launch at Woodstock starting with the most pressing issue the running area. I had sketched out a preliminary plan based on a phone conversation I had with Katie the previous week. Basically we discussed building a foundation out of the existing stone material and filling it in with stone, gravel and soil..The apprx. size of the improvement area would be 6' wide and approx. 12'-15' long and would match back to the slope behind the large rocks we are currently launching in front of now..The height at the end of the runway would need to be 2'-3' high and would blend back into the slope just past the large rocks. This would dramatically improve our running room and Cameron felt that it could be done under our existing recreational site allocation (hopefully no other overview will be neccessary). Cameron wants to review this with his Supervisor and I should hear back from him in 2-3 weeks..I also mentioned the need to take out a few trees at the base of the slot and possibly a few on the sides.. If we flag the trees Cameron mentioned he will add that project into his schedule and have them removed.. We then drove to the launch to walk the improvement areas I had outlined on paper. I mentioned that we would supply the man power and any soil,or gravel that would be needed. Any equipment such as a Bobcat would need to be operated by one of his staff (insurance issues) so if we feel this is needed we will need to schedule it in with Cameron. It appears that we can hopefully get this scheduled and completed within the next couple of months barring any problems, weather etc.. Constructing the runway should only take a day, possibly two at the most depending on the number of volunteers..Since the Capital club has the already signed all the appropriate paperwork all volunteers would have to be current Capital members..The impression I received was very positive and feel the steps we have taken in working with the Forest Service will only help us down the line in any of our future efforts.

[Ward Odenwald]

12 - 15 ft, and trees - that’s HUGE! Thanks Rich!

[markc]

Sign me up! I've got some travel at either the end of Jan or early Feb... But if some dates can be identified fairly soon, I should be able to shift things around to accommodate the construction plans. Woo-hoo, sounds fun, nice work Rich!!!

[deveil]

the nice part is that they may have equipment that is larger than a bobcat and things would go faster. also they possibly could get material by chewing some dirt and rock from the embankment at the parking area. and their machine would have a professional operator so maybe we needn't be shy about asking for some additional
'grooming" of other areas.

[RichH]

They do have some of the equipment not sure about a Bobcat but I will confirm the next time I talk with Cameron..I think the next step is getting the estimates together so we can propose it to the Capital Club.. Maybe Gary S can get with the appropriate people at the Capital Club so we can figure out how much we will need to finance this deal: Gravel, how much? Soil, how much? Possible rental of a Bobcat for a day possibly 2..Do not think we will need to much more..then when we get the word for Cameron we can get a work party together and bang this baby out!!

[deveil]

Rich, my feeling is that having one recognized project manager who could delegate certainly, but who would serve as the whip, make sure the right people were talking to the right people, keep track of what is needed, when it's needed and figure out ways to keep things rolling if things get stuck.

you've certainly shown you've got the drive and interest in this project…so i nominate You!
(just a formality actually)

gary

[davidtheamazing1]

Rich,
From CHGPA officer perspective, I think your goals and approach are right on. Let me manage any support you need from the CHGPA organization. For any outlays we do need to discuss it with members at the meeting and the board needs to vote on it, but I can manage those steps, once you have a work plan and cost estimate.

[RichH]

Working on estimates ..hope to have those soon..Rich

[Lostgriz]

Rich, As I think you know, I work in commercial construction and could possibly leverage a couple relationships to assist/consult on this project. Many of our projects have significant site components and I am confident that I have relationships that can add value to your efforts. We have a bobcat and I would be happy to provide that for a couple days use. Depending on the ultimate design for this project and the type of material that is used for fill, there are different geogrid type fabrics that are used for steep slope stabalization. We may be able to get some donated to the project if one of my relationships has a little extra laying around.

We will be starting a new project with a significant site package in February/March, so this is a good time for me to assist if you need some help.

Matt

[Lostgriz]

Also, our CEO lives within 10 minutes of the launch and is very experienced in site work, we could certainty grab him to pick his brain on this.

Matt

[Lostgriz]

Also, our CEO lives within 10 minutes of the launch and is very experienced in site work, we could certainty grab him to pick his brain on this.

Matt

[deveil]

Awesome!
we're all with you Rich.
if i myself can be of any help, give me a shout.