ok, so sparky shut down CHGPA@Groups.Yahoo.Com as we agreed to move to the chgpa.org forums.
Based on the continued particiipation on CHGA@Folkriver.com, and the sparse postings here in this forum, I gather that most of club members weren't really interested in the enhanced services of the CHGPA Forums.
Sure would love to see us have one contact center, and not two.
Anyone have ideas on how to encourage the CHGA List folks to migrate?
Cragin
ListServe Migration
Moderator: CHGPA BOD
Actually, we haven't even yet tried to 'officially' move
the list based at folkriver.com to our new CHGPA web & email
forums. The plan has been:
- move Spark's users over
- move the FiFis over
- move Scott's Off-Topic users over
- debug, fix, etc
- finally, with a working site, encourage (note the word choice)
users of folkriver.com to register here, and then subscribe to the
forums that they are interested in
The FiFi's are evaluating whether their privacy needs will be
met by the new CHGPA FiFi forum. They are also interested in image
sharing, and that's on my list of things to explore (phpbb add-on).
I'm hopeful that they will give this site a thumbs-up. Still haven't
heard from Scott....
I *did* mention that this effort was underway a couple of
months ago via the folkriver.com list. Limited feedback, but
those who replied felt that getting everything back in one
central place would be a benefit to both the club and the region.
I think that most would agree. I'll certainly brief people on the
status at the upcoming meeting.
In the meantime, all you pro-web-based forum types... Use this
new site!!
the list based at folkriver.com to our new CHGPA web & email
forums. The plan has been:
- move Spark's users over
- move the FiFis over
- move Scott's Off-Topic users over
- debug, fix, etc
- finally, with a working site, encourage (note the word choice)
users of folkriver.com to register here, and then subscribe to the
forums that they are interested in
The FiFi's are evaluating whether their privacy needs will be
met by the new CHGPA FiFi forum. They are also interested in image
sharing, and that's on my list of things to explore (phpbb add-on).
I'm hopeful that they will give this site a thumbs-up. Still haven't
heard from Scott....
I *did* mention that this effort was underway a couple of
months ago via the folkriver.com list. Limited feedback, but
those who replied felt that getting everything back in one
central place would be a benefit to both the club and the region.
I think that most would agree. I'll certainly brief people on the
status at the upcoming meeting.
In the meantime, all you pro-web-based forum types... Use this
new site!!
ListServe Migration
With thanks to Allen for setting up the forums, seems to me the CHGA
listserv wasn't broken from a technical point of view - nobody's delete
key was disabled; any of us could use it if we didn't like the content
of any individual post or thread. I have signed on to all the fora for
which I am eligible (FiFi's have not yet accepted my incognita
application) - with the e-mail feature enabled, so I think it acts just
like a listserv. ((Just don't have the habit pattern of going to a
website every day, but will log on to e-mail - and I LIKE it all mixed
up, with business, pleasure, spam, rants promiscuously intermingled.)
The unitary contact center you seek would appear to be the listserv;
c'mon back. - Hugh
On 24 Jan 2005, at 23:08, CraginS wrote:
> ok, so sparky shut down CHGPA@Groups.Yahoo.Com as we agreed to move to
> the chgpa.org forums.
> Based on the continued particiipation on CHGA@Folkriver.com, and the
> sparse postings here in this forum, I gather that most of club members
> weren't really interested in the enhanced services of the CHGPA
> Forums.
> Sure would love to see us have one contact center, and not two.
> Anyone have ideas on how to encourage the CHGA List folks to migrate?
>
> Cragin
>
>
>
>
>
listserv wasn't broken from a technical point of view - nobody's delete
key was disabled; any of us could use it if we didn't like the content
of any individual post or thread. I have signed on to all the fora for
which I am eligible (FiFi's have not yet accepted my incognita
application) - with the e-mail feature enabled, so I think it acts just
like a listserv. ((Just don't have the habit pattern of going to a
website every day, but will log on to e-mail - and I LIKE it all mixed
up, with business, pleasure, spam, rants promiscuously intermingled.)
The unitary contact center you seek would appear to be the listserv;
c'mon back. - Hugh
On 24 Jan 2005, at 23:08, CraginS wrote:
> ok, so sparky shut down CHGPA@Groups.Yahoo.Com as we agreed to move to
> the chgpa.org forums.
> Based on the continued particiipation on CHGA@Folkriver.com, and the
> sparse postings here in this forum, I gather that most of club members
> weren't really interested in the enhanced services of the CHGPA
> Forums.
> Sure would love to see us have one contact center, and not two.
> Anyone have ideas on how to encourage the CHGA List folks to migrate?
>
> Cragin
>
>
>
>
>
Hugh,
Mark set up the forums. If you subscribe to all the forums, you WILL receive all topics via email, no different than the chga list, except that it is a club-owned and managed resource, whereas the chga list is not.
You only need to visit the web site to establish or change your delivery preferences and profile, just like any listserver or yahoo group or web forum.
Mark,
Are you going to the meeting? Will you try to get this on the agenda?
In summary, I prefer this forum to the chga group.
Mark set up the forums. If you subscribe to all the forums, you WILL receive all topics via email, no different than the chga list, except that it is a club-owned and managed resource, whereas the chga list is not.
You only need to visit the web site to establish or change your delivery preferences and profile, just like any listserver or yahoo group or web forum.
Mark,
Are you going to the meeting? Will you try to get this on the agenda?
In summary, I prefer this forum to the chga group.
'Spark
ListServe Migration
Allen,
You are right, I was remiss in not recognizing all the work Mark has
been doing on this. Look, as a resolute late adopter ("let everyone
else pay the high prices and work the bugs out, then buy it on sale"),
I will go along with whatever IT support is worked out for the club
(bitching and moaning all the way). I would observe that the new
dollar coin will never take hold until the familiar old greenback
dollar bill is withdrawn from circulation... - Hugh
On 25 Jan 2005, at 06:47, Spark wrote:
> Hugh,
>
> Mark set up the forums. If you subscribe to all the forums, you WILL
> receive all topics via email, no different than the chga list, except
> that it is a club-owned and managed resource, whereas the chga list is
> not.
>
> You only need to visit the web site to establish or change your
> delivery preferences and profile, just like any listserver or yahoo
> group or web forum.
>
> Mark,
>
> Are you going to the meeting? Will you try to get this on the agenda?
>
> In summary, I prefer this forum to the chga group.
>
>
>
> 'Spark
>
>
>
>
You are right, I was remiss in not recognizing all the work Mark has
been doing on this. Look, as a resolute late adopter ("let everyone
else pay the high prices and work the bugs out, then buy it on sale"),
I will go along with whatever IT support is worked out for the club
(bitching and moaning all the way). I would observe that the new
dollar coin will never take hold until the familiar old greenback
dollar bill is withdrawn from circulation... - Hugh
On 25 Jan 2005, at 06:47, Spark wrote:
> Hugh,
>
> Mark set up the forums. If you subscribe to all the forums, you WILL
> receive all topics via email, no different than the chga list, except
> that it is a club-owned and managed resource, whereas the chga list is
> not.
>
> You only need to visit the web site to establish or change your
> delivery preferences and profile, just like any listserver or yahoo
> group or web forum.
>
> Mark,
>
> Are you going to the meeting? Will you try to get this on the agenda?
>
> In summary, I prefer this forum to the chga group.
>
>
>
> 'Spark
>
>
>
>
Yeah, if there's time I'll bring up the new CHGPA forums
at the meeting Spark. Busy agenda though, so not sure how
much time can be spent on the topic.
(anyone else think that 4 meetings a year isn't enough?)
Hugh, you were basically asking"why fix what ain't broken" ?
What do these new forums offer that's any different?
I think the answer is that things *are* broken. Fifi's over
on their own, with no obvious link to CHGPA. People periodically
PO'd about signal-to-noise ratio of a single email list. Various
web-based forums set up, with further splintering as a result.
No way to direct non-flying content to an area that's for
general discussion/off-topic types of stuff....
The new CHGPA forums are, I hope, a way to fix those
problems. If they are adopted I think they will also
be valuable in bringing new people into the sport : an active
forum with lots of good content, all visible/readable by an
interested newcomer... It can be a great resource!
(And for those who *do* prefer a web-based forum to email....
Well, the advantages over both Yahoo and the limited web
version at folkriver.com are obvious.)
For an example of a truly active forum, go check out yotatech.com
someday. Might give you an idea of what's possible.
--mark
at the meeting Spark. Busy agenda though, so not sure how
much time can be spent on the topic.
(anyone else think that 4 meetings a year isn't enough?)
Hugh, you were basically asking"why fix what ain't broken" ?
What do these new forums offer that's any different?
I think the answer is that things *are* broken. Fifi's over
on their own, with no obvious link to CHGPA. People periodically
PO'd about signal-to-noise ratio of a single email list. Various
web-based forums set up, with further splintering as a result.
No way to direct non-flying content to an area that's for
general discussion/off-topic types of stuff....
The new CHGPA forums are, I hope, a way to fix those
problems. If they are adopted I think they will also
be valuable in bringing new people into the sport : an active
forum with lots of good content, all visible/readable by an
interested newcomer... It can be a great resource!
(And for those who *do* prefer a web-based forum to email....
Well, the advantages over both Yahoo and the limited web
version at folkriver.com are obvious.)
For an example of a truly active forum, go check out yotatech.com
someday. Might give you an idea of what's possible.
--mark
ListServe Migration
OK, Mark, you convinced me. So when will we turn off the old listserv?
As mentioned, that's the real way to get people to move... - Hugh
On 25 Jan 2005, at 23:52, markc wrote:
> Yeah, if there's time I'll bring up the new CHGPA forums
> at the meeting Spark. Busy agenda though, so not sure how
> much time can be spent on the topic.
>
> (anyone else think that 4 meetings a year isn't enough?)
>
> Hugh, you were basically asking"why fix what ain't broken" ?
> What do these new forums offer that's any different?
>
> I think the answer is that things *are* broken. Fifi's over
> on their own, with no obvious link to CHGPA. People periodically
> PO'd about signal-to-noise ratio of a single email list. Various
> web-based forums set up, with further splintering as a result.
> No way to direct non-flying content to an area that's for
> general discussion/off-topic types of stuff....
>
> The new CHGPA forums are, I hope, a way to fix those
> problems. If they are adopted I think they will also
> be valuable in bringing new people into the sport : an active
> forum with lots of good content, all visible/readable by an
> interested newcomer... It can be a great resource!
>
> (And for those who *do* prefer a web-based forum to email....
> Well, the advantages over both Yahoo and the limited web
> version at folkriver.com are obvious.)
>
> For an example of a truly active forum, got check out yotatech.com
> someday. Might give you an idea of what's possible.
>
> --mark
>
>
>
>
>
As mentioned, that's the real way to get people to move... - Hugh
On 25 Jan 2005, at 23:52, markc wrote:
> Yeah, if there's time I'll bring up the new CHGPA forums
> at the meeting Spark. Busy agenda though, so not sure how
> much time can be spent on the topic.
>
> (anyone else think that 4 meetings a year isn't enough?)
>
> Hugh, you were basically asking"why fix what ain't broken" ?
> What do these new forums offer that's any different?
>
> I think the answer is that things *are* broken. Fifi's over
> on their own, with no obvious link to CHGPA. People periodically
> PO'd about signal-to-noise ratio of a single email list. Various
> web-based forums set up, with further splintering as a result.
> No way to direct non-flying content to an area that's for
> general discussion/off-topic types of stuff....
>
> The new CHGPA forums are, I hope, a way to fix those
> problems. If they are adopted I think they will also
> be valuable in bringing new people into the sport : an active
> forum with lots of good content, all visible/readable by an
> interested newcomer... It can be a great resource!
>
> (And for those who *do* prefer a web-based forum to email....
> Well, the advantages over both Yahoo and the limited web
> version at folkriver.com are obvious.)
>
> For an example of a truly active forum, got check out yotatech.com
> someday. Might give you an idea of what's possible.
>
> --mark
>
>
>
>
>
Hi Hugh,
I don't think that 'forcing' people to make the switch
is really the way to go.
I think that the new forums are finally in a good-to-go state,
at least for a first pass. I'm sure there will be further
developments.
So I will start to put together a couple of docs, along
the lines of "why make a switch?" and "how do I use
the new forums?" . Then we'll invite users of the
folkriver.com list to come on over.
Good content which illustrates the capabilities of the
new forum will also be convincing. So again, I encourage
people to post in the CHGPA forums (perhaps sending
a copy to the old folkriver.com listserv).
And if you've got suggestions for how to make the forums
better, please post them in the 'Dear Webmaster' forum.
Thanks!
I don't think that 'forcing' people to make the switch
is really the way to go.
I think that the new forums are finally in a good-to-go state,
at least for a first pass. I'm sure there will be further
developments.
So I will start to put together a couple of docs, along
the lines of "why make a switch?" and "how do I use
the new forums?" . Then we'll invite users of the
folkriver.com list to come on over.
Good content which illustrates the capabilities of the
new forum will also be convincing. So again, I encourage
people to post in the CHGPA forums (perhaps sending
a copy to the old folkriver.com listserv).
And if you've got suggestions for how to make the forums
better, please post them in the 'Dear Webmaster' forum.
Thanks!
ListServe Migration
My understanding is that the new form is still in a "Development/Test"
phase, preparatory to migration and full-time use.
~Ralph
================================================================
from: CraginS (01/24/2005 23:08)
================================================================
ok, so sparky shut down CHGPA@Groups.Yahoo.Com as we agreed to move to
the chgpa.org forums. Based on the continued particiipation on
CHGA@Folkriver.com, and the sparse postings here in this forum, I
gather that most of club members weren't really interested in the
enhanced services of the CHGPA Forums. Sure would love to see us have
one contact center, and not two. Anyone have ideas on how to encourage
the CHGA List folks to migrate? Cragin
phase, preparatory to migration and full-time use.
~Ralph
================================================================
from: CraginS (01/24/2005 23:08)
================================================================
ok, so sparky shut down CHGPA@Groups.Yahoo.Com as we agreed to move to
the chgpa.org forums. Based on the continued particiipation on
CHGA@Folkriver.com, and the sparse postings here in this forum, I
gather that most of club members weren't really interested in the
enhanced services of the CHGPA Forums. Sure would love to see us have
one contact center, and not two. Anyone have ideas on how to encourage
the CHGA List folks to migrate? Cragin
Shut down FolkRiver already
Mark, or whoever else is in charge,
>From: markc
>Hi Hugh,
>
>I don't think that 'forcing' people to make the switch is really the way to go.
That's what Sparky did, and you don't hear us going to Sparky and complaining about being kicked off. You hear us complaining about NOT shutting down the FolkRiver site.
I'm sorry, but if you "Ask" them to come over, they won't. Just face the facts and do what's needed. They loose NOTHING by joining the new forum. By moving over, they gain the CONTINUITY of being one group again w/o going to multiple sources to get complete information.
>Good content which illustrates the capabilities of the
new forum will also be convincing.
You've done that (and done a good job at it too) with minimal results.
>So again, I encourage people to post in the CHGPA forums (perhaps sending
a copy to the old folkriver.com listserv).
cc'ing or even "continuing to use" the FolkRiver forum in any way does NOTHING more than encourage folks over there that they shouldn't bite the bullet and move.
>And if you've got suggestions for how to make the forums
better, please post them in the 'Dear Webmaster' forum.
How bout combine "Hang Gliding Flight Topics" and "Paragliding Flight Topics" into one called "Flight Topics". Keeping them separate promotes the "Separation" of the sports. Most of what we do is combined.
Also rename "General Discussion" to "Off Topic". Keeping 'Political' discussions under the title 'General' defeats the purpose of the categorization to keep the flame wars to a minimum.
>rs54263
>fledgling
>------------------------------------------------
>
>My understanding is that the new form is still in a "Development/Test"
>phase, preparatory to migration and full-time use.
>
>~Ralph
I disagree, it's working just fine. The Yahoo group would not have been "Pushed" over here if it wasn't ready, right? <grin>
>=================
>from: CraginS (01/24/2005 23:0
>=================
>
>Anyone have ideas on how to encourage
>the CHGA List folks to migrate? Cragin
Yes, simply Shut down the FolkRiver forum, point blank.
This all seems sooooooo simple. Why make it difficult? Just my 2c worth.
Rance
>From: markc
>Hi Hugh,
>
>I don't think that 'forcing' people to make the switch is really the way to go.
That's what Sparky did, and you don't hear us going to Sparky and complaining about being kicked off. You hear us complaining about NOT shutting down the FolkRiver site.
I'm sorry, but if you "Ask" them to come over, they won't. Just face the facts and do what's needed. They loose NOTHING by joining the new forum. By moving over, they gain the CONTINUITY of being one group again w/o going to multiple sources to get complete information. >Good content which illustrates the capabilities of the
new forum will also be convincing.
You've done that (and done a good job at it too) with minimal results.
>So again, I encourage people to post in the CHGPA forums (perhaps sending
a copy to the old folkriver.com listserv).
cc'ing or even "continuing to use" the FolkRiver forum in any way does NOTHING more than encourage folks over there that they shouldn't bite the bullet and move.
>And if you've got suggestions for how to make the forums
better, please post them in the 'Dear Webmaster' forum.
How bout combine "Hang Gliding Flight Topics" and "Paragliding Flight Topics" into one called "Flight Topics". Keeping them separate promotes the "Separation" of the sports. Most of what we do is combined.
Also rename "General Discussion" to "Off Topic". Keeping 'Political' discussions under the title 'General' defeats the purpose of the categorization to keep the flame wars to a minimum.
>rs54263
>fledgling
>------------------------------------------------
>
>My understanding is that the new form is still in a "Development/Test"
>phase, preparatory to migration and full-time use.
>
>~Ralph
I disagree, it's working just fine. The Yahoo group would not have been "Pushed" over here if it wasn't ready, right? <grin>
>=================
>from: CraginS (01/24/2005 23:0
>=================
>
>Anyone have ideas on how to encourage
>the CHGA List folks to migrate? Cragin
Yes, simply Shut down the FolkRiver forum, point blank.
This all seems sooooooo simple. Why make it difficult? Just my 2c worth.
Rance
ListServe Migration
>
>I don't think that 'forcing' people to make the switch is really the way to go.
That's what Sparky did, and you don't hear us going to Sparky and complaining about being kicked off. You hear us complaining about NOT shutting down the FolkRiver site. I'm sorry, but if you "Ask"?them to come over, they won't. Just face the facts and do what's needed. They loose NOTHING by joining the new forum. By moving over, they gain the CONTINUITY of being one group again w/o going to multiple sources to get complete information.
Fair enough;? I just wasn't sure whether Mark had decided that the new forums were completely "ready-to-go". ?Last I knew, they were almost there, but not yet. ?Sparky's forum was a bit smaller than the Folkriver forum, I think. ?Yes, we should probably make a decision at some point to just shut down the folkriver forum, and be done with it.
cc'ing or even "continuing to use"?the FolkRiver forum in any way does NOTHING more than encourage folks over there that they shouldn't bite the bullet and move.
I agree.
Also rename "General Discussion"?to "Off Topic". Keeping 'Political' discussions under the title 'General' defeats the purpose of the categorization to keep the flame wars to a minimum.
I think there is a difference between "General Discussion" ?(which includes thinks like "Kevin's latest post", "CHGPA Meeting tonight", "Calendars for Sale", and "Anyone flying this weekend?") and "Off Topic"?(which includes things like "Lauren's latest horse show", and "Why the [xxxxx] are ruining this country").
I admit, I haven't take a look recently and the list of forums, so I don't know what is and isn't there, but this is my intuitive take on the situation.
>I don't think that 'forcing' people to make the switch is really the way to go.
That's what Sparky did, and you don't hear us going to Sparky and complaining about being kicked off. You hear us complaining about NOT shutting down the FolkRiver site.
I'm sorry, but if you "Ask"?them to come over, they won't. Just face the facts and do what's needed. They loose NOTHING by joining the new forum. By moving over, they gain the CONTINUITY of being one group again w/o going to multiple sources to get complete information.Fair enough;? I just wasn't sure whether Mark had decided that the new forums were completely "ready-to-go". ?Last I knew, they were almost there, but not yet. ?Sparky's forum was a bit smaller than the Folkriver forum, I think. ?Yes, we should probably make a decision at some point to just shut down the folkriver forum, and be done with it.
cc'ing or even "continuing to use"?the FolkRiver forum in any way does NOTHING more than encourage folks over there that they shouldn't bite the bullet and move.
I agree.
Also rename "General Discussion"?to "Off Topic". Keeping 'Political' discussions under the title 'General' defeats the purpose of the categorization to keep the flame wars to a minimum.
I think there is a difference between "General Discussion" ?(which includes thinks like "Kevin's latest post", "CHGPA Meeting tonight", "Calendars for Sale", and "Anyone flying this weekend?") and "Off Topic"?(which includes things like "Lauren's latest horse show", and "Why the [xxxxx] are ruining this country").
I admit, I haven't take a look recently and the list of forums, so I don't know what is and isn't there, but this is my intuitive take on the situation.
Geez, calm down everyone!
We haven't even gotten to the point of a documented
migration procedure for the current folkriver.com users
(some of whom don't even really know how an email
listserv works) and yer all yelling "pull the plug!
pull the plug! we can't possibly wait another minute!"
fer chrissake, RELAX!!! Things will get done.
--mark
We haven't even gotten to the point of a documented
migration procedure for the current folkriver.com users
(some of whom don't even really know how an email
listserv works) and yer all yelling "pull the plug!
pull the plug! we can't possibly wait another minute!"
fer chrissake, RELAX!!! Things will get done.
--mark