Daniels Sunday 2/13

[XCanytime]

Looks SW, good velocity, and 55+ degrees. Looking forward to possibly flying in some WARMER air. Bacil

[uplandann]

I might be interested in a morning flight before the winds get into the teens.

Ann

[jyoder111]

Current thoughts? What time were you thinking Bacil? I might be able to get off work early and get there around 4pm. That's prolly too late though, huh?

[uplandann]

Looking too strong for me...

Ann

[hang_pilot]

Interested. Will check wx in the morning. ~Daniel

[XCanytime]

Daniel, John Dullahan, and I will be there between 11A and noon. Jesse, getting there by 4P may or may not work. It may still be strong then, but if we hustle and I'm on the ground it may back down enough for you to get a short flight in. Still there's not a lot of time to walk the LZs and get the flight plan in order. It's your call. Bacil

[jyoder111]

I'll pass. Got something going on with my ear- hopefully just clogged.

[Matthew]

Sat night Forecast for Stanardsville--

SUNDAY
MOSTLY SUNNY. HIGHS IN THE UPPER 50S. SOUTHWEST WINDS
15 TO 20 MPH WITH GUSTS UP TO 30 MPH.

SUNDAY NIGHT
MOSTLY CLEAR. LOWS IN THE MID 30S. SOUTHWEST WINDS
10 TO 15 MPH WITH GUSTS UP TO 25 MPH.


... and the 3K winds aloft forecast is 40+!!!!


Are you guys kidding me? Is this just some type of joke to make me burst a blood vessel?


Matthew

[Dan T]

Daniels is a hang three site for good reason. First of all while we call it a SW site it is actually more of a S to SSW site. Once the winds get far enough west that they can roll off the ridges on the right the air in the slot as well as out front can get very dicey. I've bounced off both sides of that slot like a puck in an air hockey game. Believe me you don't want to share that experience. There is a huge difference in a light cross at six mph and a light cross at 12, by my calculation it's a 8 fold increase in energy and potential for trouble with rotor.

When I checked the weather last night the forecast was for increasing winds throughout the day and into the evening continuing tomorrow. That does not bode well for our hopes to land in gentler conditions than we launched in.

I know that you never know until you go. I also know that you can't always tell how rough it is until you get in it, and then it's too late.

[hang_pilot]

Matthew, I'll call you soon to see if you want to carpool or if you're still on the fence.

Still planning to head out unless I hear from John and Bacil that they are bailing, but will only only fly if conditions are reasonable. I'll tweet an update from the site with the CHPGA hashtag.

Best,
Daniel
301 275 6584

[mingram]

Fronts are moving through today, but I need the exercise. Headed to Taylor's now before it gets rowdy. Last weekend was no wind, forward launch practice. This weekend is high wind launch practice. Will tweet conditions to #chgpa

Matt

[Matthew]

Hey,

They've upped the forecast to gusts to 35pmh today and gusts to 30mph tonight.

Sounds like a paragliding day-- ya need at least 100mph nowadays for flying hang gliders.

Have FUN!!!!!

Matthew

[mingram]

12 flights at Taylor Hill. It was 5mph SW at 9am and was cranking 15 with gusts by 11am. Glad I came early.

Matt

[dbodner]

Are you guys kidding me? Is this just some type of joke to make me burst a blood vessel?

Don't we have an annual club award for that?

It looks a tad strong and a tad west for me, even if I weren't suffering from a cold.

[rlweber]

I was on the the fence about when and where to go today since the forecast was strong and had a westerly component. A phone call from Bacil as I was in the decision process this morning convinced me to give it a look. The Airsports. net forecast for Charlottesville showed a declining velocity and a switch towards the south for ground winds as the day progressed, along with the clouds clearing and the sun appearing. The winds aloft at 3000 were at 250 which is too west for Daniels (240 is considered the limit). So I chose to focus on the ground wind forecast and go see the conditions for myself. There are times when I have flown Daniels that the air was turbulent above a certain altitude but smooth below, depending on wind direction at each altitude. The flying was enjoyable if altitude gains were controlled.
I arrived at Daniels around 1:15 pm to find Bacil in the LZ. He had just landed and said the air was very textured. I did not have any plans to fly early so I gave him a body ride to the top and began the wait.
Indeed the day progressed, as my favored forecast for the day, predicted. The sun came out and the wind gusts decreased. However, I did not keep the faith. At around 4 I began to disassemble the glider. I noted that the winds were decreasing to a consistently flyable level as pulled the battens, thought I was hallucinating but then paid closer and saw a bird soaring comfortably out front. I quickly reassemble the glider and got a flight off around 5pm into southerly 5-10 mph winds. I had a nice launch and gently elevated to around 800 agl. At this point there was some mild to moderate turbulence, especially to the west side of launch. I also found myself in an approximately 20 mph westerly head wind. Keeping in mind how Daniels does not like a west wind I decided to go no higher. Since Bacil and Daniel were waiting for me I cut the flight short and went out to land. I did find some mild turbulence on the way out.
I practiced landing with my drogue chute, turns a U2 into a Falcon. It is amazing how fast the glide angle is decreased when speed is added. Found myself being pushed sideways as I sort of hovered down (southerly gust). I ran a few steps sideways with the glider and it settled on my shoulders. Landed on the back half of the field and had to walk the glider while avoiding the land mines deposited by the inhabitants of the field. Another obstacle was a pile of bones that was either a dead cow or a glider pilot that did not make it .
All in all an enjoyable day. Based on the varying forecasts the day could have turned out very differently and I could have easily not flown. It still would have been an enjoyable day. Thanks to Daniel and Bacil for their help.
Randy

[lbunner]

I guess hang gliders can fly in 100mph winds!

[XCanytime]

Got to Daniels around 11:20A to find Daniel (Broxterman) hanging out by the LZ. We put windsocks in and walked both LZs. Breezy at times on the ground from the instability, but nothing like the Doomsday forecast. We put Daniel's glider and equipment in my 4WD Tucson and slogged it slowly up to launch. The road condition is not the best. The fill has eroded in spots, and there's a nasty muddy rutted area that speed easily conquers. At launch it was noisy here and there from strong cycles passing through, but the general flow was a moderate 8 to 12 MPH and pretty straight in. Set up under a high overcast and watched a few black vultures penetrate out into the valley with no ill effects. Had a good launch in a light cycle around 1PM. Got hit with some strong lift out of the slot and turned right. It was very unstable; hence the air was quite textured. Got above the ridge a few times, but stepped in too many potholes of strong sink. Headed out to land in the gulley field. Hit some lift at the downwind edge of the field. Pulled in and hit the down elevator expected on the other side of the lift. Had a decent landing on the backside of the hill just past the gulley. Quickly parked the glider and unhooked. A good shakeout flight after the clevis pin replacement. Randy Weber showed up in the LZ and helped me break down the glider while an inquisitive sheep came over to check us and the glider out. It was breezy at times as we broke down the glider, but nothing like the Doomsday forecast. Got a body ride up with Randy, and he, Daniel, and I swapped stories while waiting for it to back down after the sun came out. It was nice chillaxing on the carpet in the sun. Daniel opted not to fly, and Randy had a nice launch, a nice 20+ minute soaring flight at the end of the day, and quite a unique approach with the drogue chute and a good landing. He had a 20+ knot headwind at 2700' MSL, and there was still some texture to the air. Should be no suprise with the temperature change from yesterday to today. The LZ was breezy at times when he came in to land, but nothing like the Doomsday forecast. As the sun was setting behind the Blue Ridge, a C-17 Globemaster was spotted flying overhead.

Bacil

[Matthew]

Well, I'm glad you got to fly. But I am undeterred in this simple message.

It is unsafe to go fly when winds are forecast to be gusting at 30mph or above!

Matthew

[XCanytime]

Well, I'm glad you got to fly. But I am undeterred in this simple message.

It is unsafe to go fly when winds are forecast to be gusting at 30mph or above!

Matthew

Disagree. It is unsafe to fly when winds ARE gusting to above your skill level parameters. Can you not understand that there is absolutely NO HARM in going out to take a look? Just because we are going does NOT mean we are going to fly. We had a nice day at the mountain swapping stories and laying in the sun. It is good that you are concerned, but it's not your message, it's your delivery. Heck you even have a mild mannered Clark Kent Midwesterner replying to your sarcasm. Try giving it a rest and go to a mountain planning to fly instead. You would have enjoyed yourself yesterday there. Beautiful views, relatively warm. I had a nice half hour hike along the road to the west to see where it ended (at a locked gate). Along the way you learn a little more about the site and it's weather patterns. Another data point in the endless learning that we pilots have in the realm of flying. What's not to like? Bacil

[Matthew]

TOTALLY DISAGREE!

The desire to fly is strong, patience wanes and there are too many opportunities to jump off into a sucker lull.


Matthew

[XCanytime]

We agree to disagree again. No suprise there. Not every pilot will behave in the manner you are describing, and you cannot dictate for everybody to stay home just because the forecast you believe in says this and somebody else's forecast says different. Bacil

[uplandann]

I think It comes down to being a personal choice for each pilot:

If you think you will be tempted to fly if you go out in conditions that feel unfavorable to you, then you should not go. I think Mathew is saying: flying is risky enough as it is, a gusty forecast increases that risk.

There is harm in going to a site if you feel you are wasting your day if you don't fly (tempted).

If you can take it or leave it, then I think you will make the right choice based on your experience and common sense; always aware of the risks.
There is no harm in going out to a site if you are willing to bag the day (take it or leave it).

We base a lot of our decisons to fly, or not to fly, by how we feel.
This can change from day to day with the same pilot.
Either way,if you are listening to your intuition it will generally protect you.
Know thyself...
Launching is optional, landing is manditory...
There are old pilots and there are bold pilots, but there are no old - bold pilots...
Better to be on the ground wishing you were in the air,than in the air wishing you were on the ground...
Flying is not my right, it is a privilege...

Ann

[kcarra]

I am uneasy every time Matthew puts one of those messages out there because I know it's probably going to initiate a fire storm but sometimes it's not enough to just say "Hey, let's be careful out there". Matthew's messages are over the top on purpose so that people will react, even if negatively. He is very concerned about the possibility of someone getting injured and worried that new pilots might get a false idea of what safe conditions are.

I think you have to admire someone who is willing to have criticism heaped on him when the driving impulse is to keep pilots safe.

[uplandann]

Well said, and I agree. I also believe Matthew has his fellow pilots' safety at heart.

I'm a little doubtful at this point that anything he says will keep Bacil home, though... maybe just don't post on the forum that you are going anywhere (if forecast is for gusty winds), so H-2's don't get the idea that it's safe to fly???

Ann

[John Dullahan]

Matthew benched. Karen up to Bat.

John D.