Roof rack and transporting a hang glider on a Celica

[leo]

Hi,

I've purchased a Falcon 3 and I'm wondering how to transport it safely on my 2004 Celica.

I've checked that I can get a rook rack for this car, but obviously that's too short to get a hang glider safely tied down onto this car.

Does anyone have a similar type of car and would care to share their transport solution?

Does anyone know of someone in the Baltimore/DC area who would be able to build a custom support bar that could be fixed to the front of the car?

Thanks for you suggestions!
Leo

[brianvh]

Mike Balk and I worked out a solution that would work for any car. It's a suction cup system that will put an aluminum pipe rack on your hood. I've been using it for 6 months and consider it the best rack I've ever had because it breaks down small enough to keep in any car trunk. The suction cups rarely come loose, but you can also apply a strap system for extra stability.

Our solution uses two dual suction cup glass handlers that you can get at some (not all) large stores like Lowe's or Home Depot. They can also be ordered on line: http://www.amazon.com/Dual-Glass-Suctio ... B001Z0Y33E. A pipe bender is used to put j-shaped aluminum pipe sections through the handles of the suction cup bases, then the rack itself is a U-shaped section of slightly larger diameter pipe that fits over top the bottom sections. Pins hold it together. Pad with foam insulation and gorilla tape.

If you don't want to go through all the equipment purchases and hassle and of making your own, you can contact Mike at Mike@talismanenterprises.com. Work out the needed measurements and he can make it for $100 or so (labor included). You may want to drive out to Eastern PA to pick it up, or he can make a system with more detachable parts and mail it for a bit more money.

Anyway, I consider this the perfect solution, and as Mike is self employed (and we've gone through the development process) he's ideal to make these for a good price. He's made them for me, himself, and Judy McCarty.

[brianvh]

I should add that though this is a few hours outside the Baltimore/DC area (near Bath, PA), it's well worth it for a rack system that can be fitted to any car.

[g.sessa]

I also use a homemade glider rack with suction cups. If you decide to follow this approach and build something yourself, you may save some money buying the suction cups at Harbor Freight. The suction cups sell for $6 each. They have stores locally or you can order online.

[brianvh]

Leo - I'd recommend getting together with someone who's already made a rack, either Mike or Greg (did I remember that name right?). It will save you hours of time if you don't have to go through the learning process yourself, even with something that appears simple at first. Plus save you buying tools you may only use once!

I wish I had a picture to post so you could compare models and decide which direction to go. Living in New York now my car is not just parked outside my door (no where close!), or I'd go set it up and take a picture.

[brianvh]

Last comment before I shut up: if you're the type who's anal about your paint job, don't go the suction cup route. It doesn't scratch or anything, but it will leave marks of the type some some people won't even notice, and others will go spastic.

[hang_pilot]

Hi, Leo-

Welcome to the life expanding world of free-flight! Who is your instructor? He/she can probably help you with advice on racking up your Celica, but here are a few more suggestions and comments:

1) A Tex Forest custom car rack (Does anyone know if Tex Forrest is still making racks?)

Tex is a local pilot. You'll still need a standard sport roof rack, but Tex will manufacture a very well made, custom, detachable goal post for the front end. I believe Tex lives in Woodbridge, VA and you'll have to leave the car with him for a day to have the installation work performed. This is incovenient but the finished product will be superior to other options.

Pros:
Easy on and off of the car
Multiple glider capacity

Cons:
Cost and inconvenience of the initial installation work


2) A ladder rack

An old stand-by option is to attach a junky ladder to a standard roof rack. The ladder needs to be tied down at both ends to keep it from flexing. Then you simply pad the rungs with pipe insulation from a hardware store.

Pros:
Inexpensive
Easy to put together

Cons:
Can only hold one glider*
Takes a while to rig and de-rig each time you hit the road and return home

*Your rack should carry more than one glider so you can help shuttle pilots and gliders between launch sites and landing zones. Everyone runs shuttles. Flying is a group effort. Even if you fly at a flight park, eventually you may start flying cross-country. How this often works, is you'll have someone pick you up in your car along with your buddies who have flown with you and landed out in some friendly farmer's field. You can insert wood dowels in the rungs of a ladder to carry another glider, but this is not as sturdy of a solution as a purpose-built roof rack.

3) Suction cup systems

Brian has described one. I've seen others for sale. Not to impugn what Brian has said, but I have heard that they don't fare well on really rough roads and we occasionally drive on rough roads in this sport. What about that Brian?

Blue skies,
Daniel

[brianvh]

A scary bumpy road at high speed may be a problem, but folks don't tend to do that too often. Look for the weight rating and be willing to pay more for higher poundage, though I'm not sure there's a direct correlation between cost and suction force. Mine are near the higher end costwise, and the system is usually good for an entire long weekend driving around Hyner, bumps and all. With the double suction cups, one will begin to peel before the other, giving you ample warning to fix the damage before total catastrophe. This can be mitigated by adding straps, but so far I haven't needed to. Always seal with water, and don't use single suction cups.

To me the low expense and storage convenience (I know of no other racks that fit in the trunk) far outweigh the inconvenience of having to refasten them if you do more than an overnight trip with potholes. I can carry 4 gliders, and can not imagine ever owning a different rack system: and I've done everything except the Tex rack.

As I said, if you care about a pristine car paint finish, or if you plan to take rough gravel roads at high speeds on a consistent basis, the suction cup rack is not for you. If you do get one, be sure to do it right - which is why I recommend getting together with someone else who has done it. Mike and I had one quicky iteration (I'd call it a failure), and learned a lot from it. I'm sure Greg can provide pointers as well.

[chuckok]

I'm using pre-made suction cup system with a Thule roof rack. Have a look at ...

http://www.turfhouse.com/cgi-bin/sh0000 ... tml%23a132

I went from using two of these with a Maxima. But, I've been able to reduce to one for the new Vibe I'm driving. If you're interested in the extra, give me a call.

[brianvh]

Are those double cups on each foot, or single cups? If double cups I'd jump on it for that price.

[brianvh]

Oh, if scrolling down it looks like the foot is a single cup. That's a little dicey. and the price is in pounds, so it's more than I thought. I'd go with the double cup (4 total) local made ones, though it's not as simple as a mail order that's already made to pack for shipping.

If it was a truck we were talking about, I'd say get a Tex rack, but you don't put a celica through the same punishment, so the suction will be fine.

[leo]

Thanks a bunch for all the advice, you guys are great. I'll probably go ahead with the double suction cups, but will still try to call Tex to see what he says...

[davidtheamazing1]

I have a Tex rack. I'm very happy with how sturdy it is and how it has held up over time. He has made over 100 of them.

[PKane]

The racks I make and use are Dbl. suction cups, telescoping uprights and any width you want. Proven from VA to CA to FL and back to VA. I sell them for $175.each. Ive sold them as far away as CA. E-mail me and I'll send you some pics.(I don't know how to post pics on here) Peter

[KirkLewis]

I have a 2D coupe mustang, and I bought a Yakima rack system with a "stretch" system. These allow the rear bar to be placed further back on a 2 door car and gives you better stability. I don't know if it's really necessary but it gives me some peace of mind. Then I put a ladder on top of the rack, strap that down, and strap the glider down to the ladder. The front I tie down with some rope to some lighter rope that go under the hood. If you don't like the idea of using suction cups this might be a solution. The downside his having to store a ladder as well.

[CraginS]

... The downside his having to store a ladder as well.

Having a ladder strapped to the top of a vehicle at a flying site is not always a bad thing. I know of at least one case where said ladder became integral to a tree-landing retrieval. I feel sure there have been other instances, too.

Also, several local club members have worked out procedure for carrying more than one glider on a ladder, by using wooden rods, length roughly triple the width of the ladder, through several of the tube-style ladder rungs.

[Richard Hays]

Get a new car. LOL : D

[CraginS]

Hey, Brian!
How about resurrecting those photos you took the week you did a bit of house-sitting for Joe and Janet?

[brianvh]

That was 3 computers and 1 major operating system change ago. I still have that computer, but after plugging it in and firing it up I may not find that picture. Mike Chevalier gets half the credit for the photoshop work he did on it. If anyone has windrider archives it will be in there.

[brianvh]

Sorry, I meant Skyline. Here's the link: http://www.go-get.com/skyline/index00.htm

[brianvh]

Dang cascading links. Click on 'sep' at the top bar, then go to the sidebar and click on "meanwhile..."