Friday flying ?

[mikel]

Thinking Woodstock.......noonish......

Any takers ?

304-279-3131

'Til then, Mike

[mikel]

At Charles Town 1000 AM ....
Just finished washing one of
the gliders....

Ayone playing hookie ?

Give me a Call......

'Til then, mike

[mikel]

It was an uneventful day.... Gary S. called me as I was headed
towards Front Royal.... said he was going to meet me up top at
2:00 PM... this was probably at 11:30 AM, so I headed down Rt.
11 and stopped by Brothers Pizza in Maurertown... Good eats if
you're ever down that way. afterwords, went to the LZ, of course
It looked DEAD..... So, got bored and went to the top. started up
launch, and found a bunch of spectators....then, headed back to
the truck.... it was a pretty clear decision on which glider to fly,
It was a double surface day for sure. so I toted the Moyes SX4 up
the trail and passed the Wuffos enroute... As soon as I finished setting
up, I went to the truck to pickup my harness when Gary pulled in.
After gary had finished setting up, he helped me launch, then he
followed soon afterwards.

Now, I kinda scatched for 10- 15 minutes at ridge altitude, when
I look over and see Gary getting up there... so I thought maybe
I can get closer to the ridge, then catch something to climb out....
Well, that went on for about 45 minutes...upwards of 4600 then back
down to 2200.... I'm thinking "this sucks" I've been in the air for an
hour and haven't hit the good stuff.. Gary drops below me and waves
me to follow , or so I thought. UP the ridge to the North, we play
See-Saw the whole way. As gary played closer to the valley, I decided
to explore the penetration of this new glider, so I started hooking into
some good lift, 600, then 800 up. which took me over the back into
the valley. tried that rope thingy....(VG) LOL, pulled it on and Zoom...
It was like no effort at all. in no time flat I was back out to the valley.
trying to keep Gary in sight was kinda hard when I was above him...
but I quickly picked him back up when he got higher.

Now, here it is, 1:45 into the flight.... and I got into a moster...Started
climbing more and more. 4000, 4500, 5000, A mile, still going.....HOLY
CRAP !!!!! this is the "S".... Lift started to peter out around 5700 agl...
As i looked across the valley, the clouds were all lined up at my elevation..
Well, this must be cloudbase ? i thought....Now what ? I boated around
for a few more minutes, when I thought," where's Gary ? Scanning, scanning, scanning.... no gary..... Oh wait, there he is .. he's going to land...Since I didn't want to hike up by myself, I wanted to head down...
Ok, pull in, wooshh, noise, but no altutude loss. this thing wont get down...
let me try cross wind, 360's, stalls, but nothing worked... it stayed right there..... Maybe you might want to try going out into the valley and then try to lose alt. by going down wind.......I thought... so out I go... then coming back its working....down, down, down.... but the Glide on this thing
is super !!!! 360's down, "S" turns down. Now , time to land and i'm setting up an approach... extend, flat, don't PIO, I kept telling myself...
al the while forgetting my altitude.........I thinking this don't look right...
"S" I'm too high ! can I bail? which side? Can I make it over the tree line to the field to the west...? when all of a sudden.....BAM!!! ole mother nature made up my mind. she lifted my left wing sending me down wind at about 100 feet.... so I thought maybe if I crank it around I'll end back
on top of the LZ.....WELL.....as the glider went down wind it was as if the
wind caught the high wing and wouldn't let it come back around....I got sucked down in the bottom, and almost made it facing the correct way, when .....WHAM !!! left down tube took the brunt of it....not injuries , other than , pride.....

all in all 2:00 hours 5700 ft. great time..

'Til then, Mike

[hepcat1989]

Wow Mike! Good Going! I'm glad you're allright!
Parts can be ordered and replaced! Bones take longer!
Peace, Shawn.

[mcelrah]

"Uneventful"?! Great write-up. And great flight! - Hugh

[Matthew]

Hi Mike,

Glad you are okay. I'm totally confused as to what went wrong with your landing approach. Maybe you can make it down to the meeting on Wednesday and explain it better or draw it out.

Matthew

[mikel]

Matthew,
It was a typical transitional mistake. Everyone knows that there is a substanial difference between a falcon and a higher performance wing.
Just so happened that, I know this also, however, knowing and getting used to it are two different worlds.
Now, for the meat of this. It was in the back of my mind, "LONG, FLAT
APPROACH." ..... I had made a few "S" turns, extended out towards the river, in order to achieve this but the combination of a glider with a better glide, and an LZ which was lifting off complicated the formula.
It was looking good as I extended to the river, and the last time I had flown this glider, I had a problem with PIO'ing so I slowed down and that solved that problem. then I entered a bit of lift, which kept me aloft without losing any altitude as I was still covering the ground. that is when I realized "opppps" I'm way to high..... that's when I ran through my options.....bail here, or there, and the stories of other pilots hitting the trees......Half way through the LZ, I'm probably 100' above the crest when ,"WHAM !" that's when I got turned. So I just got dealt lemons, what else to do other than make lemonade. Maybe, I thought, I can whip this around and pull it off.... NOT ! but made it about 340 out of 360 degrees around. that's when, I saw the ground coming up and i flared, started running. "Boom!", A sound I thought I would never hear, actually happened. Gary came down, asked if I was ok. after saying I was fine, he said, I scared him to death....
Conditions, New Glider, and Pilot Skills, contributed to this accident... plain and simple... I thank all of my fellow pilots for their in-sight, and guidance through this past year of my training. and notes were imbedded in my brain, and technique. I spoke with Gary about this, and Shawn also. I need to practice more, and more, and hope that corrects the issue.
In most cases in this sport, there are two types of pilots, "Those who have, and those that will. " meaning you are never completly the perfect pilot without errors.... some have had accidents and others are bound to.

Thanks again,

'Til then, Mike

[brianvh]

When I've been playing around with double surface I'd get scared by PIO and so end up flying slower on approach than safe. It really takes other experienced pilots to watch you and tell you if your speed is right. And practice landing in the morning and the end of the day so you can push your speed...when you oscillate you know it's not turbulence, it's just you finally going too fast. During a transition to double surface I can't emphasize enough the need to practice in non-thermally conditions until you've got the speeds and angles down blindfolded.

I totalled a double surface glider when I was at exactly your experience level. It's an eye opening experience. So I probably don't need to say it, but please fly the falcon when it's cooking and then run back up top for a practice flight with the Moyes at the evening. Spend 10-20 flights getting dialed in before trying the big time. Towing helps but you also need to practice mountain LZ restrictions in easy air before you get hit by thermals on approach.

for anyone else about to make 'the transition', try to be more nervous than excited. It's safer.

[deveil]

:

pilot induced oscillations, focusing on it, affecting the choice of flying speed. . .

learned awareness of the feel of muscle tension vs. the feel of muscles, limbs, body relaxed except those necessary to perform the immediate task. taught in martial arts as a means to not waste energy, facillitate speed and power, stay centered and balanced and prepared. two cents.

(but yeah, being out of touch with the glider can definetly bite you)

[mikel]

I really want to thank you guys for being vocal.
that means more to me then standing by and saying
"good job, BUT " .... Points are well taken and
will be followed.

Hope you all are doing good, (Gary and Brian)
we'll be seeing ya'll in the air soon..

'Til then, Mike

[Dan T]

Those can't get down conditions at Woodstock are more common than you might think. The are usually associated with a lot of turbulance low, especially behind the trees. The woodstock primary is not an easy field to get into safely when thngs are boiling off. There are a lot of better alterantives in both directions along the ridge and out in the valley.

I particularly like the one across the road from the budget host inn, near the Edinburg gap. It's huge, it's an easy retrieve because you are right on 11 and on a day like the one you described it would have been easy to get there. There is another huge field across 11 near the school, it slopes a little uphill into the wind. It's a little harder to reach.

Almost any of them including the two bridge fields are usually better choices when things are cooking. Tis better to be scolded than broken.

dan t

[mcelrah]

Mike,
Here are some musings about what I have learned personally (and to some extent by the "Braille" method - bumping into trees etc.). Perhaps you can get something out of them - or else one of the gurus will offer a corrective:
- for a double surface/higher performance wing getting into a somewhat tight LZ like Woodstock: lower your altitude for turning downwind.
If you used to start at 500 in your Falcon, try 350. Yeah, you can't really trust your altimeter, but I try to get as low over the trees bordering the LZ as I'm comfortable (not really comfortable close to trees, though).
- I like diving it into the hole at the bottom of the LZ, so I'm never worried about floating into the fence/trees at the top. The up slope then enforces a short decisive flair rather than a float/whack. Joe G.'s experience getting slammed into the ground has me nervous about whether there is something wrong with this approach, though...
- after a case of getting turned while on low approach to High Rock LZ, I took instruction and rebuilt my landing approach technique.
Key points:
* SPEED, SPEED, SPEED - remember there's a big wind gradient down in that hole - so "AIRSPEED, AIRSPEED, AIRSPEED" - forget about groundspeed (easy to say, hard to do)
*keep both hands on the control bar even though your legs are out of the harness and you are "upright" - all the way into ground effect
* then transition to downtubes, minimizing the inevitable pop-up as you lose pitch authority
* wait for speed to decay, testing with slight pitchups
* if you think it might be time to flare - IT'S TIME TO FLARE - do not delay further
* have your hands up on the downtubes at the level of your ears and throw a huge one as quickly and decisively as you can
* quick and decisive will limit the amount of pop-up - but if you do, hold the flair and use your shock absorbers (knees)
- Hugh

[deveil]

another point on focus. pick you spot in the lz. stay focussd on it.

driving school at summit point raceway. going through the "carousel" - the twisties. you're just into a right hander, four wheel drift, steering with both the throttle and the wheel, a guy on your bumper, you on the guy in front of you. instructor in the passenger seat throws his arm across the windshield and almost your face, forcing your vision, your focus, to the tight Left that is the next immediate piece of business. you've just hit the apex of the right, your in the middle of it.
it seems that your mind, your vision, already has that sized up. it's a matter of learning to trust and fully use all that computing power and learning how to "lead" it. also in spring board diving - the body naturally follows where the head and eyes are pointing and telling it where it's going to go. it's just a matter of believing it yourself! Hah!

(also once took a class in needlepoint, but i couldn't figure out how to work it in

[mikel]

First thing I would like to say is, that I am lucky to have friends who care enough to tell me when I 'm doing something "BONEHEADED"....
I can not say thank you too many times !!!!! even those who give me a stare or say something that will eventually get back to me...
I could do the Romper room magic mirror thing, but in one way or the other everyone, who I have met has helped to shape me as a hang glider pilot. There is no greater feeling, then to know that the folks whom which I share this sport, care for their fellow pilots and myself included...
Evidence is clear in the way we treat others such as Mrs. Emma Jane.
I have a long aviation past, one I do not need to delve into, however,
it holds true there are old pilots and bold pilots, but very few old bold pilots...

Thanks one and all for keeping me safe....

'Til then, Mike

[John Simon]

Hi Mike,
this is a really good thread, lots to learn. Great stuff from Dan, Brian, Hugh and all. I have recently been flying a bunch of topless gliders... I've flown them before but in the last month I've got a lot of time on highly tuned gliders, Lightspeed S and RS, Combat, T2. I have been aware and ready for PIO on approach and have practiced at altitude turning at good speed until I was comfortable. Only once in a dozen or so flights did I get PIO on approach, I got it fixed quickly.
Then, a couple days ago I'm back to my trusty Discus... I have maybe 150 hours on this glider and know her well. I haven't flown her in a couple weeks, but surely this is not a problem... I approach and I am getting hammered by a thermal, more speed, MORE SPEED. As I turn final I am shocked to find myself in PIO! BTW, I really, really needed the speed, at 100ft I hit sink like I have never seen before, all the way to 10' above the ground like a rock, without all that speed I would have planted that glider.
My landing is safe and average but not really good. But, my point here is fly your glider fast at altitude until you can do it without thinking and can correct any PIO quickly. This is important because some days you're gonna want a LOT of speed as you approach in a nasty LZ and if you haven't been practicing, it can bite you. Speed is good on approach.

Have Fun,

John

[deveil]

yeah, quite often, from what i've noted, the person who opened the discussion with a post of an unabashed accounting of a particular experience - well, they actually have provided the service of having started a more general discussion to a wider audience. it's not so much "piling on" as jumpin in!